The Dark Knight (Batman Begins 2) Discussion - Part 3
01-12-09, 02:04 PM
#301
Banned by request
Re: The Dark Knight (Batman Begins 2) Discussion - Part 3
Actually, here's a thought. You could make an argument that, if anyone in TDK represents Bush, it's actually Harvey Dent. Discuss.
01-12-09, 02:14 PM
#302
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Re: The Dark Knight (Batman Begins 2) Discussion - Part 3
I quite enjoyed it, but being a moron who reads comics from time to time, I didn't really get it. I like the purty pictures, tho.
01-12-09, 02:25 PM
#303
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Re: The Dark Knight (Batman Begins 2) Discussion - Part 3
Since he's on my ignore list I haven't read much of what he's been saying outside of when he's quoted by others, but since he's pissed off so many you'll have to forgive him...he's from Quebec and lives in Toronto (thanks Google), surrounded by English-speaking folks who all hate Quebec for wanting to separate from the rest of Canada...it's understandable that, as a result of this he hates everybody.
Don't take it personally.
I don't hate Quebec but I hate Toronto. Fucking overtaxed deathhole of a city. Fucking Miller.
I admit I do like Dubya. He's a funny guy but I don't think he's as smart as The Batman. Is Alfred representing Cheney or is Lucius? They both have a flair for weapons but I don't know if either one ever shot Bruce thinking he was a wild animal, even in the Batsuit.
If Joker is literally a terrorist in the film, what terrorist is he? A McVeigh type? Certainly not a Bin Laden type. I mean if certain characters are thought to represent real public figures, who does he represent?
Oh, I know that one: Krusty the Clown - the evil Krusty doll from the Hallowe'en specials, not the 'real' one...
Don't take it personally.
I don't hate Quebec but I hate Toronto. Fucking overtaxed deathhole of a city. Fucking Miller.
I admit I do like Dubya. He's a funny guy but I don't think he's as smart as The Batman. Is Alfred representing Cheney or is Lucius? They both have a flair for weapons but I don't know if either one ever shot Bruce thinking he was a wild animal, even in the Batsuit.
If Joker is literally a terrorist in the film, what terrorist is he? A McVeigh type? Certainly not a Bin Laden type. I mean if certain characters are thought to represent real public figures, who does he represent?
Oh, I know that one: Krusty the Clown - the evil Krusty doll from the Hallowe'en specials, not the 'real' one...
Last edited by Nick Martin; 01-12-09 at 02:28 PM.
01-12-09, 03:37 PM
#304
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Re: The Dark Knight (Batman Begins 2) Discussion - Part 3
Baracine, I read your review. Your tone is so condescending and contemptuous that your ideas about the film as analogy to the Bush adminitration, while interesting and deserving of discussion, get lost in the vitriol. You appear to admonish people who like this film to grow up, but your actions in this thread paint you as the neighborhood bully with a thesaurus.
01-12-09, 03:44 PM
#305
Suspended
Re: The Dark Knight (Batman Begins 2) Discussion - Part 3
Just curious if you've read the Watchmen? They wear tights/costumes, but I think most anyone who's read it would say it's not idiotic drivel. As a matter of fact, didn't Time Magazine call it one of the top 100 works of fiction in the 20th century?
I quite enjoyed it, but being a moron who reads comics from time to time, I didn't really get it. I like the purty pictures, tho.
I quite enjoyed it, but being a moron who reads comics from time to time, I didn't really get it. I like the purty pictures, tho.
The initial premise for the series was to examine what superheroes would be like "in a credible, real world".
As the story became more complex, [writer Alan] Moore said Watchmen became about "power and about the idea of the superman manifest within society." The writer stated in the introduction to the Graphitti hardcover that while writing Watchmen he was able to purge himself of his nostalgia for superheroes, and instead he found an interest in real human beings.
Bradford Wright [author of Comic Book Nation: The Transformation of Youth Culture in America] described Watchmen as "Moore's obituary for the concept of heroes in general and superheroes in particular." Putting the story in a contemporary sociological context, Wright wrote that the characters of Watchmen were Moore's "admonition to those who trusted in 'heroes' and leaders to guard the world's fate." He added that to place faith in such icons was to give up personal responsibility to "the Reagans, Thatchers, and other 'Watchmen' of the world who are supposed to 'rescue' us and perhaps lay waste to the planet in the process".Moore specifically stated in 1986 that he was writing Watchmen to be "not anti-Americanism, [but] anti-Reaganism," specifically believing that "at the moment a certain part of Reagan's America isn't scared. They think they're invulnerable." While Moore wanted to write about "power politics" and the "worrying" times he lived in, he stated the reason that the story was set in an alternate reality was because he was worried that readers would "switch off" if he attacked a leader they admired. Moore stated in 1986 that he "was consciously trying to do something that would make people feel uneasy."
As the story became more complex, [writer Alan] Moore said Watchmen became about "power and about the idea of the superman manifest within society." The writer stated in the introduction to the Graphitti hardcover that while writing Watchmen he was able to purge himself of his nostalgia for superheroes, and instead he found an interest in real human beings.
Bradford Wright [author of Comic Book Nation: The Transformation of Youth Culture in America] described Watchmen as "Moore's obituary for the concept of heroes in general and superheroes in particular." Putting the story in a contemporary sociological context, Wright wrote that the characters of Watchmen were Moore's "admonition to those who trusted in 'heroes' and leaders to guard the world's fate." He added that to place faith in such icons was to give up personal responsibility to "the Reagans, Thatchers, and other 'Watchmen' of the world who are supposed to 'rescue' us and perhaps lay waste to the planet in the process".Moore specifically stated in 1986 that he was writing Watchmen to be "not anti-Americanism, [but] anti-Reaganism," specifically believing that "at the moment a certain part of Reagan's America isn't scared. They think they're invulnerable." While Moore wanted to write about "power politics" and the "worrying" times he lived in, he stated the reason that the story was set in an alternate reality was because he was worried that readers would "switch off" if he attacked a leader they admired. Moore stated in 1986 that he "was consciously trying to do something that would make people feel uneasy."
Last edited by baracine; 01-12-09 at 03:51 PM.
01-12-09, 03:49 PM
#306
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Re: The Dark Knight (Batman Begins 2) Discussion - Part 3
There's no question that Watchmen was political. I'm not sure that The Dark Knight was intended to be, though. Sure, the script attempted to blur the line between the "good guys" and the "villain", but I didn't see any intentrional commentary on the Bush administration.
01-12-09, 03:50 PM
#307
Suspended
Re: The Dark Knight (Batman Begins 2) Discussion - Part 3
Baracine, I read your review. Your tone is so condescending and contemptuous that your ideas about the film as analogy to the Bush adminitration, while interesting and deserving of discussion, get lost in the vitriol. You appear to admonish people who like this film to grow up, but your actions in this thread paint you as the neighborhood bully with a thesaurus.
In any case, it's always a good idea to grow up.
Last edited by baracine; 01-12-09 at 03:56 PM.
01-12-09, 04:19 PM
#308
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Re: The Dark Knight (Batman Begins 2) Discussion - Part 3
I think Bandoman is actually trying to help you understand why you always have the same problems in these types of threads, but your immediate response is to get defensive and snarky. The problem I'm seeing is that you come in with big overarching pronouncements and statements that leave little room for actual discussion, because your phrasing and writing style treats anyone who believes differently like idiot children. Looking back at your posts in this thread alone, I didn't see any place where you seemed to want to discuss anything with anyone; you just seemed eager to announce your opinion with huge blocks of condescending text. To me, there is no way to approach someone who talks like that. If you don't think this board is up to your level of intelligent discourse, maybe you should stop posting here.
01-12-09, 04:21 PM
#309
DVD Talk Hero
Re: The Dark Knight (Batman Begins 2) Discussion - Part 3
I should have known of course that this is not the place for any intelligent discussion of this type because of the anti-literary and anti-intellectual bent - not to mention the bad manners - of most posters, some of which even admit to not reading the reviews mentioned before commenting on them.
I also don't read comic books, so you and I are intellectual equals. I don't even read Tin Tin so I may actually be more intelligent.
01-12-09, 05:03 PM
#310
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Re: The Dark Knight (Batman Begins 2) Discussion - Part 3
Just curious if you've read the Watchmen? They wear tights/costumes, but I think most anyone who's read it would say it's not idiotic drivel. As a matter of fact, didn't Time Magazine call it one of the top 100 works of fiction in the 20th century?
I quite enjoyed it, but being a moron who reads comics from time to time, I didn't really get it. I like the purty pictures, tho.
I quite enjoyed it, but being a moron who reads comics from time to time, I didn't really get it. I like the purty pictures, tho.
Watchmen was intensely political. This is from Wikipedia's entry on the subject: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Watchme..._and_reception
01-12-09, 05:22 PM
#311
Suspended
Re: The Dark Knight (Batman Begins 2) Discussion - Part 3
Listen. I don't care if Watchmen is about the restructuration of higher education. I never read it and never will. I suppose it's slightly less objectionable than works of its time and I will take its author's word that it was directed against Reagan's America. The point here is if you admire Watchmen without knowing its political foundation and you admire the Dark Knight without really knowing what it's about, you're really missing the whole point.
01-12-09, 05:26 PM
#312
Suspended
Re: The Dark Knight (Batman Begins 2) Discussion - Part 3
I think Bandoman is actually trying to help you understand why you always have the same problems in these types of threads, but your immediate response is to get defensive and snarky. The problem I'm seeing is that you come in with big overarching pronouncements and statements that leave little room for actual discussion, because your phrasing and writing style treats anyone who believes differently like idiot children. Looking back at your posts in this thread alone, I didn't see any place where you seemed to want to discuss anything with anyone; you just seemed eager to announce your opinion with huge blocks of condescending text. To me, there is no way to approach someone who talks like that. If you don't think this board is up to your level of intelligent discourse, maybe you should stop posting here.
Last edited by baracine; 01-12-09 at 05:51 PM.
01-12-09, 05:26 PM
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01-12-09, 05:30 PM
#314
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Re: The Dark Knight (Batman Begins 2) Discussion - Part 3
Ohhh, advice on how to run my life from FinkPish... Looking back on your entire interactions with me going back many years, I don't remember your ever saying anything that wasn't an insult of a defensive-reflex grunt or that vaguely resembled the will to contribute anything to any discussion. People like you lead me to believe that there really is something to Lisa Simpson's discovery of a pheromone she called "pointdextrose" emitted by intelligent people that cause people like you to instantly see red and turn into drooling bullies.
01-12-09, 05:48 PM
#315
Suspended
Re: The Dark Knight (Batman Begins 2) Discussion - Part 3
Advice from the person who just called me a stuck-up **** with the moderator's blessing, advice from a member who has never said anything constructive within my hearing range in the last six years, advice from a poster who specializes in personal attacks and character assassination, advice from one who doesn't even pretend take the trouble to find out what my posts are actually about before putting on his boxing gloves? I think I'll pass.
Last edited by baracine; 01-12-09 at 05:51 PM.
01-12-09, 05:58 PM
#316
DVD Talk Godfather
Re: The Dark Knight (Batman Begins 2) Discussion - Part 3
baracine: Dismissing Watchmen for being a comic book is like dismissing, say, Ratatouille because it's "just a kid's movie about a rat"...
If you want to choose to not be informed on some of the great fiction coming from "sequential art" in the past twenty years, then that's your choice. But it's about as childish and moronic as someone saying they don't want to see movies from before 1960 because they are in black and white or are too old-fashioned.
If you want to choose to not be informed on some of the great fiction coming from "sequential art" in the past twenty years, then that's your choice. But it's about as childish and moronic as someone saying they don't want to see movies from before 1960 because they are in black and white or are too old-fashioned.
01-12-09, 06:30 PM
#317
Suspended
Re: The Dark Knight (Batman Begins 2) Discussion - Part 3
baracine: Dismissing Watchmen for being a comic book is like dismissing, say, Ratatouille because it's "just a kid's movie about a rat"...
If you want to choose to not be informed on some of the great fiction coming from "sequential art" in the past twenty years, then that's your choice. But it's about as childish and moronic as someone saying they don't want to see movies from before 1960 because they are in black and white or are too old-fashioned.
If you want to choose to not be informed on some of the great fiction coming from "sequential art" in the past twenty years, then that's your choice. But it's about as childish and moronic as someone saying they don't want to see movies from before 1960 because they are in black and white or are too old-fashioned.
My estimate is that there are maybe 30-40 people like who all have a score to settle and who will jump on the bullying bandwagon and won't stop long enough to breathe, let alone to consider whether my argument has any value. So I'll just call it a day.
Last edited by baracine; 01-12-09 at 06:36 PM.
01-12-09, 06:44 PM
#318
Banned by request
Re: The Dark Knight (Batman Begins 2) Discussion - Part 3
baracine,
I have engaged in reasonable discussion with you before. Note that I am not a moderator of this forum, and thus it is not my place to police personal attacks. FinkPish did get a warning for his remark, and if you find other offensive, please use the report this post to a mod button.
That being said, the way you're behaving in this thread is very condescending and alienating, which is what is prompting the personal attacks. I am going to have to agree to a previous post suggesting that if you consider this thread or forum to be filled with morons, then you should go find a forum where the base level of discussion is more attuned to yours.
I have engaged in reasonable discussion with you before. Note that I am not a moderator of this forum, and thus it is not my place to police personal attacks. FinkPish did get a warning for his remark, and if you find other offensive, please use the report this post to a mod button.
That being said, the way you're behaving in this thread is very condescending and alienating, which is what is prompting the personal attacks. I am going to have to agree to a previous post suggesting that if you consider this thread or forum to be filled with morons, then you should go find a forum where the base level of discussion is more attuned to yours.
01-12-09, 07:16 PM
#319
DVD Talk Legend
Re: The Dark Knight (Batman Begins 2) Discussion - Part 3
I thought I read that baracine said he was going to...in our plebian words, get the fuck out of this thread and let us continue the Dark Knight discussion.
If anything baracine is like the Joker...in that he makes and retracts statements at random.
"Hancock was based on a COMIC BOOK!"
"No, it wasn't."
"Yes it was! Look...click this link!"
"Actually, that proves you're wrong. Hancock was made for the silver screen."
"Well...DUH! Also, I like tin-tin."
= J
If anything baracine is like the Joker...in that he makes and retracts statements at random.
"Hancock was based on a COMIC BOOK!"
"No, it wasn't."
"Yes it was! Look...click this link!"
"Actually, that proves you're wrong. Hancock was made for the silver screen."
"Well...DUH! Also, I like tin-tin."
= J
01-12-09, 09:55 PM
#320
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Re: The Dark Knight (Batman Begins 2) Discussion - Part 3
Baracine, I've never talked you at all but man, you either go way too far or you're just really...well...too into something that's just not there. I mean it's not like you're even trying to debate anything, just spouting off random shit that is plain nonsense.
I've read "that guy's" review and it was actually a little disturbing that he took it that far as well.
Just two wasted boring pages of nothing.
Nothing personal but...what are you trying to get at? It's like it starts to make sense...possibly even reaching a point.......then it all just goes really wrong.
I've read "that guy's" review and it was actually a little disturbing that he took it that far as well.
Just two wasted boring pages of nothing.
Nothing personal but...what are you trying to get at? It's like it starts to make sense...possibly even reaching a point.......then it all just goes really wrong.
01-12-09, 10:20 PM
#322
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Re: The Dark Knight (Batman Begins 2) Discussion - Part 3
Maybe if you'd all stop feeding him he'd go away. I know it never works, but the less people respond the more a troll has to do all the work and it's even funnier.
01-13-09, 07:23 AM
#325
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Re: The Dark Knight (Batman Begins 2) Discussion - Part 3
How can you analyze something without reading it? Relying on second-hand accounts, reviews and analyses is far inferior to reviewing the source material for yourself. You don't seem to have any interest in a reasonable discussion, however, so I'm going to step away from this thread.