At what point in Star Wars Episode 1 were your hopes crushed?
#101
DVD Talk Hero
Re: At what point in Star Wars Episode 1 were your hopes crushed?
Whoever edits the movies simply does a horrible job. Every ligetsabre duel is cut up among other stuff, some inane like the Gungan battle in TPM and Endor in RotJ, others not at bad as the escape from Cloud City and the attack on the second Death Star.
I remember reading before RotS came out that Lucas was going to run the entire 19 minute Obi/Vader duel uninterupted because that was the culmination of the entire series. Well look what we ended up getting there.
I remember reading before RotS came out that Lucas was going to run the entire 19 minute Obi/Vader duel uninterupted because that was the culmination of the entire series. Well look what we ended up getting there.
#102
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
It's funny you said that because Paul Hirsch/Richard Chew edited Star Wars, and Paul Hirsch edited Empire, and that is a big reason why those movies are so great. If you watch the Empire of Dreams Documentary, Hirsch/Chew pretty much chopped up Star Wars from scratch and re-edited the whole movie to give it better pacing. I think Jedi and the Prequels suffer from editing problems as the movies just come to a complete hault in many parts, and that never happens in Star Wars and Empire.
#103
DVD Talk Legend
Re: At what point in Star Wars Episode 1 were your hopes crushed?
It ruins all the tension from what to that point was the best duel in the series. They go from something serious to not one but 2 children centric scenes in the Gungan battle and a 9 year old taking out the entire Trade Federation fleet.
#104
Moderator
Re: At what point in Star Wars Episode 1 were your hopes crushed?
This will maybe sound like cynical sour grapes with 15 years worth of hindsight, but I swear it's true. I was so, so excited. And then, there was this exchange...
Captain: "With all due respect, the ambassadors for the Supreme Chancellor wish to board immediately."
Nute Gunray: "Yes, of course. As you know, our blockade is perfectly legal and we'd be happy to receive the ambassadors."
Right there, the fourth and fifth lines of dialogue, mere seconds after the opening crawl, something felt "off." The delivery (so, so wooden, plus the Nute Gunray puppet mouth), the content (exposition much?), the non sequitur (why the demand and the immediate yeah, absolutely). This sounds like such a snarky answer to me, like I'm making it up to sound cool. But seriously, I remember being at that midnight screening, so excited, then that exchange happened, and I remember that I winced.
Watch it and tell me it's not a terrible, forbidding moment of what is to come.
Captain: "With all due respect, the ambassadors for the Supreme Chancellor wish to board immediately."
Nute Gunray: "Yes, of course. As you know, our blockade is perfectly legal and we'd be happy to receive the ambassadors."
Right there, the fourth and fifth lines of dialogue, mere seconds after the opening crawl, something felt "off." The delivery (so, so wooden, plus the Nute Gunray puppet mouth), the content (exposition much?), the non sequitur (why the demand and the immediate yeah, absolutely). This sounds like such a snarky answer to me, like I'm making it up to sound cool. But seriously, I remember being at that midnight screening, so excited, then that exchange happened, and I remember that I winced.
Watch it and tell me it's not a terrible, forbidding moment of what is to come.
#105
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Re: At what point in Star Wars Episode 1 were your hopes crushed?
I haven't seen the movie since I saw it in the theater. I remember convincing my dad, who doesn't really like science fiction/fantasy films, into going with me. After the movie, I apologized to him. I think by the end of the pod race, I knew the film wasn't going to get better.
#106
DVD Talk Legend
Re: At what point in Star Wars Episode 1 were your hopes crushed?
This will maybe sound like cynical sour grapes with 15 years worth of hindsight, but I swear it's true. I was so, so excited. And then, there was this exchange...
Captain: "With all due respect, the ambassadors for the Supreme Chancellor wish to board immediately."
Nute Gunray: "Yes, of course. As you know, our blockade is perfectly legal and we'd be happy to receive the ambassadors."
Right there, the fourth and fifth lines of dialogue, mere seconds after the opening crawl, something felt "off." The delivery (so, so wooden, plus the Nute Gunray puppet mouth), the content (exposition much?), the non sequitur (why the demand and the immediate yeah, absolutely). This sounds like such a snarky answer to me, like I'm making it up to sound cool. But seriously, I remember being at that midnight screening, so excited, then that exchange happened, and I remember that I winced.
Watch it and tell me it's not a terrible, forbidding moment of what is to come.
Captain: "With all due respect, the ambassadors for the Supreme Chancellor wish to board immediately."
Nute Gunray: "Yes, of course. As you know, our blockade is perfectly legal and we'd be happy to receive the ambassadors."
Right there, the fourth and fifth lines of dialogue, mere seconds after the opening crawl, something felt "off." The delivery (so, so wooden, plus the Nute Gunray puppet mouth), the content (exposition much?), the non sequitur (why the demand and the immediate yeah, absolutely). This sounds like such a snarky answer to me, like I'm making it up to sound cool. But seriously, I remember being at that midnight screening, so excited, then that exchange happened, and I remember that I winced.
Watch it and tell me it's not a terrible, forbidding moment of what is to come.
#108
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
I'm still inclined to believe that the resolution would've been more satisfying even as one film if Kurtz, Kershner, and Kasdan had been allowed to take the finale in the direction which they'd intended.
#109
DVD Talk Special Edition
Re: At what point in Star Wars Episode 1 were your hopes crushed?
Paul_SD and I don't agree on much, but he's spot on with his analysis of ROTJ... The climax of the film is decent enough, I suppose, but it's intercut with the on-ground battle on Endor, which is comically small scale compared to the starfighter battle and Luke's fight with Vader.
#111
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Re: At what point in Star Wars Episode 1 were your hopes crushed?
It's worth noting that, when TESB was made, there were still four planned movies to follow it. And then, sometime shortly after, Lucas decided to finish off the saga with the next film. Which is why ROTJ has this sort of odd structure where the first half of the film is rescuing Han Solo, and the second half is defeating the Empire and tying up all of the loose ends left over from TESB.
As revealed by Gary Kurtz, here is the original plan for the complete nine-film saga circa 1980:
#112
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#113
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Re: At what point in Star Wars Episode 1 were your hopes crushed?
Do not let the final light saber duels fool you. Revenge of the Sith is a boring and awful movie along with the other Prequels.
#114
Re: At what point in Star Wars Episode 1 were your hopes crushed?
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#116
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Re: At what point in Star Wars Episode 1 were your hopes crushed?
I agree with Patton Oswalt's view that seeing OT characters as little kids is the last thing anyone wanted to see:
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<iframe width="560" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/dUWdjVcenKU" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
#117
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Re: At what point in Star Wars Episode 1 were your hopes crushed?
I haven't seen the movie since I saw it in the theater. I remember convincing my dad, who doesn't really like science fiction/fantasy films, into going with me. After the movie, I apologized to him. I think by the end of the pod race, I knew the film wasn't going to get better.
After the movie she asked me "What the hell was that? What just happened?" I shamefully replied, "I'm not sure. I'm sorry. Just try to pretend you didn't see it and we'll go home to watch the real thing."
#118
Re: At what point in Star Wars Episode 1 were your hopes crushed?
When all the pretty fantasy CGI bullshit scenes came into play. The whole scuba diving scene, jar jar binks, the political council bullshit.
The only great thing that Episode I had going was Darth Maul. That's it. The rest can be summed up as one big pile of fossilized desert camel shit.
I have not bothered to view Episode III because I got diarrhea from watching Episode II: Attack of The Clones which was another clusterfuck.
The only great thing that Episode I had going was Darth Maul. That's it. The rest can be summed up as one big pile of fossilized desert camel shit.
I have not bothered to view Episode III because I got diarrhea from watching Episode II: Attack of The Clones which was another clusterfuck.
#119
Re: At what point in Star Wars Episode 1 were your hopes crushed?
Damn. Never knew The Phantom Menace was this generation's Birth of a Nation.
#120
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
Re: At what point in Star Wars Episode 1 were your hopes crushed?
When jar jars tongue got zapped so he talked like Mushmouth from Fat Albert. Shit was so racist I thought he was going to light up a Newport.
#121
Re: At what point in Star Wars Episode 1 were your hopes crushed?
I had been a Star Wars fan very briefly in elementary school because of the action figures and later seeing Return of the Jedi. I thought it was awesome. I later caught The Empire Strikes Back on television and didn't it like it very much. It was depressing, not as colorful as ROTJ, no Ewoks, and overall not very fun. It didn't even have a real ending. I then moved onto Marvel comics and forgot about Star Wars.
Episode I came out when I was in high school but couldn't care less about it. Later I heard how bad it was, but didn't rent it till 2006. I didn't think it was so bad. Liam Neeson was great, I thought, as Qui Gon Jinn. Although I thought Darth Maul's design was a little too extreme, he was a cool villain. It wasn't great, but I thought it was entertaining enough.
After that I rewatched the original trilogy and realized that The Empire Strikes Back was the best film in the series and really established the best aspects of the mythos, and that Episode I was a serious step down. Going from Yoda's great speech about the Force being around us, flows through us, luminous beings are we, not this crude matter, to midichlorian counts really sapped the magic from the franchise.
Subsequent viewings of Episode I only made it worse. Rewatching the OT reminded me how mythical and fantastic the world of Star Wars was to my younger self. Yeah, the Ewoks taking down the Empire was stupid though, as well as Leia being his sister. The interactions between the characters in Episode I just weren't very good, and the lightsaber battle in ROTJ, although not as gracefully choreographed, at least looked like both combatants were trying to hurt each other.
But it was at least better than Attack of the Clones, but not as good as ROTS which had some of the best moments in the PT like Order 66 and the Obi-Wan/Anaking battle just prior to the ridiculous lava platforming.
Episode I came out when I was in high school but couldn't care less about it. Later I heard how bad it was, but didn't rent it till 2006. I didn't think it was so bad. Liam Neeson was great, I thought, as Qui Gon Jinn. Although I thought Darth Maul's design was a little too extreme, he was a cool villain. It wasn't great, but I thought it was entertaining enough.
After that I rewatched the original trilogy and realized that The Empire Strikes Back was the best film in the series and really established the best aspects of the mythos, and that Episode I was a serious step down. Going from Yoda's great speech about the Force being around us, flows through us, luminous beings are we, not this crude matter, to midichlorian counts really sapped the magic from the franchise.
Subsequent viewings of Episode I only made it worse. Rewatching the OT reminded me how mythical and fantastic the world of Star Wars was to my younger self. Yeah, the Ewoks taking down the Empire was stupid though, as well as Leia being his sister. The interactions between the characters in Episode I just weren't very good, and the lightsaber battle in ROTJ, although not as gracefully choreographed, at least looked like both combatants were trying to hurt each other.
But it was at least better than Attack of the Clones, but not as good as ROTS which had some of the best moments in the PT like Order 66 and the Obi-Wan/Anaking battle just prior to the ridiculous lava platforming.
#122
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Re: At what point in Star Wars Episode 1 were your hopes crushed?
I still say Revenge of the Sith is the worst of the Prequels, simply because THIS had all the plot points that fans had waited for all those years and Lucas dropped the ball on most of them:
-Anakin's turn was horrendous and happened within 3 seconds? He goes from being a good guy to slaughtering all the Jedi at the temple simply because a guy who lied to everyone for 10 years says he MAY know a trick to bring back the dead?
-Padme losing the will to live goes against everything that was said in Return of the Jedi when Leia talks about, "How she died while I was very young." And it also makes Padme look like a jerk for bailing on her 2 kids after they are born!
-The Duel between Anakin/Obiwan was so underwhelming, very few dialogue until the end, and just a blown opportunity by Lucas. The Emperor/Yoda was actually better, IMO.
-Episode I & II storyline should have been Episode I, while Episode III storyline should have been Episode II & III as Revenge of the Sith just looks like rush job of Lucas doing a checklist of all the plot points he could get in. Order 66, check! Birth of Vader, check! Bring Luke to Owen/Beru, check! Start building the deathstar, check!
-Anakin's turn was horrendous and happened within 3 seconds? He goes from being a good guy to slaughtering all the Jedi at the temple simply because a guy who lied to everyone for 10 years says he MAY know a trick to bring back the dead?
-Padme losing the will to live goes against everything that was said in Return of the Jedi when Leia talks about, "How she died while I was very young." And it also makes Padme look like a jerk for bailing on her 2 kids after they are born!
-The Duel between Anakin/Obiwan was so underwhelming, very few dialogue until the end, and just a blown opportunity by Lucas. The Emperor/Yoda was actually better, IMO.
-Episode I & II storyline should have been Episode I, while Episode III storyline should have been Episode II & III as Revenge of the Sith just looks like rush job of Lucas doing a checklist of all the plot points he could get in. Order 66, check! Birth of Vader, check! Bring Luke to Owen/Beru, check! Start building the deathstar, check!
#124
DVD Talk Special Edition
Re: At what point in Star Wars Episode 1 were your hopes crushed?
It really was bad... started off OK, but the climbing and surfing on the lava? Good grief. No emotion at all in what was supposed to be a battle between brothers.
#125
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Re: At what point in Star Wars Episode 1 were your hopes crushed?
Putting aside the 'I am your father' moment, the whole duel is great because it had great dialogue, great emotion, great drama you really feel for Luke after he pretty much gets his ass kicked by Vader.
The Anakin/Obiwan duel was just alot of action and stunts and then has some dialogue at the end, and then you're pretty much happy after Obiwan cuts up Anakin cause he is so damn annoying throughout the trilogy!