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Breaking Bad --> Series Finale --> "Felina" --> 9/29/13
10-01-13, 10:20 AM
#501
Re: Breaking Bad --> Series Finale --> "Felina" --> 9/29/13
I think his original plan wasn't to go after Jesse, mainly because he figured Jesse was dead, and there wasn't anything he could do about it. When he suspected Jesse was alive after talking to the Numbnut Twins, I think he made it part of the plan he already had. He was going to kill the Nazis anyway, and if they hadn't brought Jesse in the room, he would have killed them anyway and gone to free him. Mentioning Jesse to Jack made it clear that he made freeing Jesse part of his plan. No matter what happened between him and Jesse, there's still that relationship there.
10-01-13, 10:26 AM
#502
DVD Talk Legend
Re: Breaking Bad --> Series Finale --> "Felina" --> 9/29/13
BTW, I say watch all of the seasons. Why skip one?
10-01-13, 11:26 AM
#503
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Re: Breaking Bad --> Series Finale --> "Felina" --> 9/29/13
He made no real effort to make sure Jesse would be there, only Jack and gang, and that M60 setup was a "kill everybody" kind of a deal.
And now that I think about it again, he seemed to have that plan in place BEFORE he talked to Skyler, BEFORE he knew about Lydia and the threat to Holly, and BEFORE he was sure it was Jesse cooking the blue meth. I might be wrong on the last one though.
I do agree that he wanted to kill Jesse, just because of the way he says "Jesse Pinkman" when he asked about the blue meth. I just can't shake the feeling that 1) he lacked proper motivation for his his plan before talking to Skyler and 2) his plan didn't necessarily even lead him to Jesse. As far as he knew, Jesse was cooking in an underground lab in a junkyard. He also wasn't after his money...only revenge for Hank, and maybe Jesse with a little bit of luck.
10-01-13, 11:31 AM
#504
Moderator
10-01-13, 12:00 PM
#505
DVD Talk Legend
Re: Breaking Bad --> Series Finale --> "Felina" --> 9/29/13
I think Walt's motivation before finding out that the Nazi's were a danger to his family was because he wanted to shut down all production of the blue meth. That included taking out Lydia.
10-01-13, 12:37 PM
#506
Re: Breaking Bad --> Series Finale --> "Felina" --> 9/29/13
Taking down Lydia was for Skylar's protection. She told Walt about The men that threatened her about talkIng about Lydia. Walt knows she like to clean up loose ends and leaving her alive would lead to Skylar's death.
10-01-13, 01:02 PM
#507
Suspended
Re: Breaking Bad --> Series Finale --> "Felina" --> 9/29/13
Exactly. I think the combination of Hank's murder and seeing Gretchen and Elliot talk about him on TV made Walt "break good," for lack of a better term. He realized he had built a legacy of evil and wanted to destroy as much of that legacy as possible.
10-01-13, 01:04 PM
#508
DVD Talk Legend
Re: Breaking Bad --> Series Finale --> "Felina" --> 9/29/13
Well then, if Walt included killing Jesse in his plan, why did he knock him down on the floor to protect him from the gunfire? Seems a silly move for someone you want dead.
10-01-13, 01:06 PM
#509
DVD Talk Legend
Re: Breaking Bad --> Series Finale --> "Felina" --> 9/29/13
He saw what had been happening to him over the last few months and felt bad. It was all Walt's fault Jesse was in that position.
10-01-13, 01:08 PM
#510
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Re: Breaking Bad --> Series Finale --> "Felina" --> 9/29/13
Tackling Jesse also gave him a convenient way to duck to the ground to avoid gunfire. Otherwise he was going to have to pull a Pierce Hawthorne fake heart attack to hit the ground.
10-01-13, 01:13 PM
#511
Moderator
Re: Breaking Bad --> Series Finale --> "Felina" --> 9/29/13
That night was Walt's endgame. He initially planned to take the gunfire along with the Nazis...until he saw Jesse's condition and deemed him worthy of saving.
10-01-13, 01:16 PM
#512
DVD Talk Legend
Re: Breaking Bad --> Series Finale --> "Felina" --> 9/29/13
Yup. He originally wanted Jesse in there so he'd get hit too, assuming he was working with them as a partner. That all changed when he got a look at him.
10-01-13, 01:18 PM
#513
DVD Talk Legend
Re: Breaking Bad --> Series Finale --> "Felina" --> 9/29/13
I don't buy that Walt thought Jesse might have been working with them willingly. He knew they took him away as a rat, to probably torture and kill him. Up until he finished up with Badger and Skinny Pete, he must have just blown off Jesse as most likely being dead. He had to know Jesse was most likely being used against his will, and regardless of the bad times they went through at the end, and the fact that it was essentially Jesse's fault Hank was dead, I think he went in there to save him. The way Walt was throwing Jesse's name at Jack was definitely in a goading fashion, but I don't think he knew that Jack would actually bring Jesse out. If Walt wanted to kill Jesse, he could have easily done it after he killed Jack.
10-01-13, 01:20 PM
#514
DVD Talk Legend
Re: Breaking Bad --> Series Finale --> "Felina" --> 9/29/13
But Walt didn't know about that until after he made the decision to kill Lydia.
10-01-13, 01:22 PM
#515
DVD Talk Legend
Re: Breaking Bad --> Series Finale --> "Felina" --> 9/29/13
Okay, I've been reading your responses, and I will buy that Walt may have intended to get Jesse in there to kill him with the Nazis, and changed his mind once he saw how Jesse was being used. That makes sense.
10-01-13, 01:37 PM
#516
DVD Talk Legend
Re: Breaking Bad --> Series Finale --> "Felina" --> 9/29/13
I gave the ending 4 stars, but given the chance, would go back and make it 5. The longer I think about it, read theories on it, and just absorb it, the happier I am with it.
10-01-13, 01:38 PM
#517
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Re: Breaking Bad --> Series Finale --> "Felina" --> 9/29/13
Half of this thread could be avoided if you guys would've just read that interview.
http://insidetv.ew.com/2013/09/30/br...ince-gilligan/
On the story inspiration for Walt, who was hellbent on killing Jesse, saving his ex-partner out of sudden instinct
“A lot of astute viewers who know their film history are going to say, ‘It’s the ending to The Searchers.’ And indeed it is. The wonderful western The Searchers has John Wayne looking for Natalie Wood for the entire three-hour length of the movie. She’s been kidnapped by Indians and raised as one of their own, and throughout the whole movie, John Wayne says, ‘I need to put her out of her misery. As soon as I find her, I’m going to kill her.’ The whole movie Jeffrey Hunter is saying, ‘No, we’re not — she’s my blood kin, we’re saving her,’ and he says, ‘We’re killing her.’ And you’re like, ‘Oh my god, John Wayne is a monster and he’s going to do it. You know for the whole movie that this is the major drama between these two characters looking for Natalie Wood. And then at the end of the movie, on impulse, you think he’s riding toward her to shoot her, and instead he sweeps her up off her feet and he carries her away and he says, ‘Let’s go home.’ It just gets me every time — the ending of that movie just chokes you up, it’s wonderful. In the writers room, we said, ‘Hey, what about the Searchers ending?’ So, it’s always a matter of stealing from the best. [Laughs]“
“A lot of astute viewers who know their film history are going to say, ‘It’s the ending to The Searchers.’ And indeed it is. The wonderful western The Searchers has John Wayne looking for Natalie Wood for the entire three-hour length of the movie. She’s been kidnapped by Indians and raised as one of their own, and throughout the whole movie, John Wayne says, ‘I need to put her out of her misery. As soon as I find her, I’m going to kill her.’ The whole movie Jeffrey Hunter is saying, ‘No, we’re not — she’s my blood kin, we’re saving her,’ and he says, ‘We’re killing her.’ And you’re like, ‘Oh my god, John Wayne is a monster and he’s going to do it. You know for the whole movie that this is the major drama between these two characters looking for Natalie Wood. And then at the end of the movie, on impulse, you think he’s riding toward her to shoot her, and instead he sweeps her up off her feet and he carries her away and he says, ‘Let’s go home.’ It just gets me every time — the ending of that movie just chokes you up, it’s wonderful. In the writers room, we said, ‘Hey, what about the Searchers ending?’ So, it’s always a matter of stealing from the best. [Laughs]“
at the shots of baby Holly
10-01-13, 02:12 PM
#519
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Re: Breaking Bad --> Series Finale --> "Felina" --> 9/29/13
My interpretation of the finale's chronology.
1). Walt's time in seclusion made him realize that he has nothing left in this world, and a barrel full of money means nothing when you're by yourself. The moment Walt Jr. hung up on him is when Walt made the decision to give up, and let the police capture him.
2). Watching Elliot and Gretchen on TV made him realize that just like Gray Matter, the blue meth, and all the hard work he put into creating it was being tarnished by someone else. History will write off Heinsenberg as just another part in the machine, and he'll soon be forgotten. Also, he made the choice to go on a suicide mission taking down everybody that is part of the machine he helped create, and to also avenge Hank.
3). Having Elliot and Gretchen give money to Walt Jr. and not Skylar symbolized how proud Walt was of his son. His son protected his mother, and refused his father's dirty money. Despite anything, Walt Jr. is a good kid. He knows right from wrong. He will take care of his mother and sister; and even Aunt Marie, and he'll get to do it without owing anything to his father.
4). Lydia had to die. She's responsible for many people dying for her survival (prison murders as well as Declan's crew). At this point, Walt doesn't know about Lydia sending Todd and crew to scare Skylar, but he does know that Lydia and Skylar have met. Walt understood that Lydia will always be a loose thread, and has corrupted many people along the way. As long as she's alive, she'll do whatever it takes to survive and profit.
5). Walt telling Skylar that he did it for himself was the first real bit of honesty Walt has uttered on the show. Typically he speaks of doing these unspeakable things for his family, putting the ethical burden squarely on their shoulders. Every time he says that everything was done for his family, he's essentially telling them that it's all their fault they can't take care of themselves when he's gone. Walt finally admitting he did it for himself as some sort of midlife crisis gave Skylar a bit of relief and made her empathetic to this broken down man standing before her. The man she loved died on his 50th birthday. The cancer triggered something in him. The loss of true consequences made him feel alive for the first time; and Hank's death snapped him out of it. It was all fun and games until someone he loved died.
6). Walt saying goodbye to Holly was the saddest moment of the series. Holly represents the future; one that he was never going to see happen. Walt's cancer was going to kill him no matter what, and his petting of Holly as she laid asleep was just heartbreaking. She will never know her father, except as a monster. Walt Jr. could at least hold onto some memories of his father before he broke bad, and maybe one day could see him as a tragic figure. Holly, on the other hand, will just know Heisenberg.
7). Walt wanted to kill all the Nazis, and especially himself. He did not want Jesse dead, unless he was tattooed up and buddy buddy with the Nazis. If he had the opportunity to save him, he would; but honestly, his focus was taking down everybody that wronged him. In his months in seclusion, he absolutely thought about everything he did to Jesse, and how he manipulated this poor kid. Telling Jesse about Jane was Walt shifting blame for Hank's death onto Jesse (if you didn't push me to putting a hit on you, and then working with Walt and Gomez, they'd still be alive).
8). Walt asked about Jesse to buy some time so he could get the keys. Walt was about to be marched outside and executed; and the only way to for Walt to actually get the keys was to attack Uncle Jack's integrity. Once Walt saw the hell that Jesse's life became, and the fact he was an actual slave, he made the decision to save him. Otherwise, Walt could have just turned the gun on and kill everybody. Walt jumped on Jesse and shielded him while the bullets fired from the trunk.
9). Walt wanted Jesse to kill him because he was sorry for everything he had done. Walt assumed that Jesse had spent the last few months dreaming of the day where he could kill Walt. Jesse refused to kill him, showing that he was no longer taking orders from anybody. Walt knew he had been mortally wounded, and wanted to let Jesse have the honors and closure that comes with killing Heisenberg. So as Jesse speeds off to freedom, Walt spends his final moments appreciating an empire he built; knowing that the legacy of blue meth began and ended with Walter White.
1). Walt's time in seclusion made him realize that he has nothing left in this world, and a barrel full of money means nothing when you're by yourself. The moment Walt Jr. hung up on him is when Walt made the decision to give up, and let the police capture him.
2). Watching Elliot and Gretchen on TV made him realize that just like Gray Matter, the blue meth, and all the hard work he put into creating it was being tarnished by someone else. History will write off Heinsenberg as just another part in the machine, and he'll soon be forgotten. Also, he made the choice to go on a suicide mission taking down everybody that is part of the machine he helped create, and to also avenge Hank.
3). Having Elliot and Gretchen give money to Walt Jr. and not Skylar symbolized how proud Walt was of his son. His son protected his mother, and refused his father's dirty money. Despite anything, Walt Jr. is a good kid. He knows right from wrong. He will take care of his mother and sister; and even Aunt Marie, and he'll get to do it without owing anything to his father.
4). Lydia had to die. She's responsible for many people dying for her survival (prison murders as well as Declan's crew). At this point, Walt doesn't know about Lydia sending Todd and crew to scare Skylar, but he does know that Lydia and Skylar have met. Walt understood that Lydia will always be a loose thread, and has corrupted many people along the way. As long as she's alive, she'll do whatever it takes to survive and profit.
5). Walt telling Skylar that he did it for himself was the first real bit of honesty Walt has uttered on the show. Typically he speaks of doing these unspeakable things for his family, putting the ethical burden squarely on their shoulders. Every time he says that everything was done for his family, he's essentially telling them that it's all their fault they can't take care of themselves when he's gone. Walt finally admitting he did it for himself as some sort of midlife crisis gave Skylar a bit of relief and made her empathetic to this broken down man standing before her. The man she loved died on his 50th birthday. The cancer triggered something in him. The loss of true consequences made him feel alive for the first time; and Hank's death snapped him out of it. It was all fun and games until someone he loved died.
6). Walt saying goodbye to Holly was the saddest moment of the series. Holly represents the future; one that he was never going to see happen. Walt's cancer was going to kill him no matter what, and his petting of Holly as she laid asleep was just heartbreaking. She will never know her father, except as a monster. Walt Jr. could at least hold onto some memories of his father before he broke bad, and maybe one day could see him as a tragic figure. Holly, on the other hand, will just know Heisenberg.
7). Walt wanted to kill all the Nazis, and especially himself. He did not want Jesse dead, unless he was tattooed up and buddy buddy with the Nazis. If he had the opportunity to save him, he would; but honestly, his focus was taking down everybody that wronged him. In his months in seclusion, he absolutely thought about everything he did to Jesse, and how he manipulated this poor kid. Telling Jesse about Jane was Walt shifting blame for Hank's death onto Jesse (if you didn't push me to putting a hit on you, and then working with Walt and Gomez, they'd still be alive).
8). Walt asked about Jesse to buy some time so he could get the keys. Walt was about to be marched outside and executed; and the only way to for Walt to actually get the keys was to attack Uncle Jack's integrity. Once Walt saw the hell that Jesse's life became, and the fact he was an actual slave, he made the decision to save him. Otherwise, Walt could have just turned the gun on and kill everybody. Walt jumped on Jesse and shielded him while the bullets fired from the trunk.
9). Walt wanted Jesse to kill him because he was sorry for everything he had done. Walt assumed that Jesse had spent the last few months dreaming of the day where he could kill Walt. Jesse refused to kill him, showing that he was no longer taking orders from anybody. Walt knew he had been mortally wounded, and wanted to let Jesse have the honors and closure that comes with killing Heisenberg. So as Jesse speeds off to freedom, Walt spends his final moments appreciating an empire he built; knowing that the legacy of blue meth began and ended with Walter White.
10-01-13, 02:27 PM
#520
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
Re: Breaking Bad --> Series Finale --> "Felina" --> 9/29/13
Once Walt talked to Skinny Pete and Badger, he had to have known Jesse wasn't voluntarily working with the Nazis. They hadn't seen him in months and thought he had gone to Alaska. Jesse isn't the type who's going to just partner up with those guys and completely alienate his two bffs.
10-01-13, 03:17 PM
#521
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Re: Breaking Bad --> Series Finale --> "Felina" --> 9/29/13
Breaking Bad will not only be remembered as a TV drama that went out on top — creatively, and in terms of popularity — but possibly as a game-changer for underdog TV shows. The second half of the fifth season premiered last month to a stunningly large audience for the long-struggling cult-favorite series, delivering a record 5.9 million viewers. A couple weeks ago, ratings notably rose to 6.4 million viewers. Then last week’s penultimate hour crept up to 6.6 million.
For the grand series finale Sunday night, Breaking Bad hit 10.3 million viewers, with a 5.2 rating among adults 18-49.
http://insidetv.ew.com/2013/09/30/br...inale-ratings/
For the grand series finale Sunday night, Breaking Bad hit 10.3 million viewers, with a 5.2 rating among adults 18-49.
http://insidetv.ew.com/2013/09/30/br...inale-ratings/
10-01-13, 04:01 PM
#522
DVD Talk Platinum Edition
Re: Breaking Bad --> Series Finale --> "Felina" --> 9/29/13
whyd he have to pop the trunk to start firing the gun? It was shooting through the car right?
10-01-13, 04:13 PM
#523
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Re: Breaking Bad --> Series Finale --> "Felina" --> 9/29/13
10-01-13, 04:15 PM
#524
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Re: Breaking Bad --> Series Finale --> "Felina" --> 9/29/13
Now give me my no prize.
10-01-13, 04:52 PM
#525
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Re: Breaking Bad --> Series Finale --> "Felina" --> 9/29/13
Season 4 of The Shield.
Season 4 is the catalyst of the Strike Teams end and is an incredible jump in quality compared to seasons past. Adding Close and Anthony (wow) took this series to new heights. Even if you viewed it as a Antwon Mitchell intro, he's important because:
Such as? The relationship between Macky and Shane is broken up from the beginning so nothing really changes. The whole season was about taking down Antwon Mitchell and doesn't move forward the main storyline of the strike team paying and getting caught for their previous sins.
Spoiler: