canaryfarmer

If by "single disc version" you mean the old MGM version (it would have to be, right?), yeah, it's not the director's cut. The only unrated versions available in R1 are the Criterion and the newer MGM which is only available in the trilogy set.

Josh Z

Anamorphic or not, MGM's transfer is a disgrace. The Criterion disc has much more accurate coloring.

Egon's Ghost

I've just noticed the DVDTalk review of the BluRay release...seems like it's piss-poor. Sad. One of my favorite movies...what am I to do? I prefer the cinema cut, but the Criterion does look better in terms of color. Is it worth tracking down for over 30 bucks? I guess it depends how much I care. I saw Robocop at the cinema in 1.85:1, and on video countless times hacked to 4:3. So the aspect ratio isn't a huge priority for me. Damn MGM and Sony, scourges of all filmdom.

baracine

I've said it before and I'll say it again. Although I keep my Criterion issue as a collector's item, its colour is yellowed and depresssing. I much prefer the new transfer of the boxset which makes it look like a bright shiny penny and is superior on all counts.

Egon's Ghost

People here seem to be divided on which coloring looks better. From screenshots, the Criterion looks more natural; the MGM looks dark, with over-saturated skin tones.

dullboy

If you want the MGM unrated in the boxset, DeepDiscount has it for $27 and change and you can couple it with another box set to get one of them free. Other choices include Alien Quadrilogy, the latest Planet of the Apes box and the Rocky box.
http://www.deepdiscountdvd.com/promo...e=foxb1g1_1206

baracine

The new boxset also has about an hour of "making of" featurettes including an new 40 minute documentary and tells you more about the film, commentary and all, than the Criterion edition does. It also solves the problem of how the hell are you suppose to frame a 1.66:1 presentation on a 1.77:1 widescreen TV by offering a very clear 1.77:1 transfer.

Egon's Ghost

Ah, so I see "widescreen" is the new fullscreen.

Josh Z

The proper way to frame a 1.66:1 movie on a 16:9 screen is to anamorphically enhance it and put small pillarbox bars on the sides. Unfortunately, the Criterion disc is non-anamorphic without pillarboxing, while the MGM simply crops the top and bottom of the frame. Neither is ideal.

MGM's oversaturated cartoon colors are obscene. Do you honestly believe that people are supposed to have glowing orange flesh tones? Yes, the Criterion transfer is "depressing". That's the way the movie was meant to look. It's set in post-apocalyptic Detroit, ferchrissakes.

nin74

I agree with Josh. The MGM dvd is crap. It also have the contrast boosted (for looking like a newer movie?) and losing detail and changing the whole image:

Criterion:


MGM:


*pics from dvdbeaver*

Egon's Ghost

In the MGM's defense, it looks sharper to me. In the end, the prices that the Criterion fetch right now are too high, especially for non-anamorphic. This is one of my favorite movies, but I'm ready to wash my hands of the whole thing. If Sony released a stand-alone of the first movie from the boxset, I would get it.

baracine

Come on... Give in... You know you want it! Besides, the Trilogy packaging is easily the best thing available this side of the Atlantic in the way of artistic presentation.

baracine

What dvdbeaver doesn't tell you, of course, is that there is actually a character in the lower portion of that shot. A character who is visible in the MGM transfer but almost invisible in the grimy Criterion edition...

They also chose not to show scenes where aliasing is a big problem in the Criterion edition, mainly whenever an office has venetian blinds or an object has a mesh surface.

I'm also quoting from this lady (http://www.amazon.com/Robocop-Trilog...?ie=UTF8&s=dvd) who did a comparison on Amazon.com:

Josh Z

Criterion didn't create the "Director's Cut" and didn't touch the sound mix. They presented the movie's soundtrack as it was given to them by the filmmakers.

MGM tinkered with the soundtrack to perform their 5.1 remix, which is why this person thinks it sounds better. Personally, I thought the 5.1 remix sounded pretty poor. It's rather shrill and has lots of hollow ambience and gimmicky artificial directional steering.

baracine

If I may add my grain of salt: The original soundtrack was Dolby Stereo (four channels of sound encoded on 2 side-by-side strips of film delivering left, right, centre and surround channels once decoded). The new 5.1 remix simply assigned the left, centre and right information to individual channels, made the surround channel stereo - which the Pro Logic II system does anyway with the surround channel of Dolby Stereo on most home systems - and added a subsonic (.1) channel (which is definite, if non-directional, improvement on the original).

If it sounds "gimmicky", it's simply because each channel delivers more uncompressed, undistorted information than the old Dolby Stereo set-up. So, by definition, it cannot sound "poor", especially in relation to the Dolby Stereo soundtrack it was derived from. The original mix mostly used the surround channels (which are the echo of the right and left channels) for more music and sound effect diffusion in the action scenes. Anything on top of that, in the way of directional sound, would be an improvement. But, unfortunately, this is not the case.

Robocop is a film where all the dialogue comes from the centre speaker, the left and right channels being used mostly for stereo sound effects and music reproduction and the surround channels being the discrete echo of the left and right channels. It sounds good because it works: the dialogue is clear, the sound effects are convincing and the music is rousing. Anything else in the way of "directionality" is all in your mind. No new material was added to the surround channels that wasn't already in the left and right channels of the original mix.

Josh Z

Have you actually listened to the RoboCop 5.1 remix or are you speaking in generalities? Yes, the sound effects originally existed in the 2-channel mix, but now many that previously came from the front speakers have been artificially steered to the surrounds in a manner that sounds fake and unnatural. Ambient sounds have also been totally removed from the front and moved exclusively to the rear, leaving the soundstage feeling hollow and unbalanced. They've also beefed up the bass way beyond anything found in the original mix, and it just sounds boomy and obnoxious.

This is a very common problem when studios take it upon themselves to tinker with perfectly good 2-channel sound mixes (RoboCop was nominated for an Ocar for Best Sound) in order to give DVD fans more activity in their rear speakers and subwoofers. At least in this case MGM didn't actually replace the original sound effects with inappropriate new ones (see: The Terminator), but frankly they should just leave well enough alone.

Egon's Ghost

I'm leaning away from the box. I've seen the unrated director's cut, and I liked it less than the cinema release. They removed some cheesy footage, and I think the film was better for it. Therefore, I don't want the unrated cut in the box. I am not a "director's cut" true believer.

baracine

I had my ear glued to the surround speakers as I was writing the last post and I can't detect a single instance of surround activity that isn't the echo of the left and right front speakers, just as in the original award-winning Dolby Stereo mix. If the .1 channel disturbs you, you can always turn it off.

Egon's Ghost

I think I'll rent the stand-alone MGM cinema cut and see how I like the quality. It's really a shame that Robocop had to fall into the hands of MGM/Sony (though I like their 2001 Terminator SE).

Mondo Kane

I see that another release will appear on June 5th. Besides having a lenticular cover, will this finally be the first time (As far as MGM's concerned) that the unrated cut will arrive in solo form?

Abe.

I was wondering about that release as well... the waiting game begins.

I prefer the MGM (boxset) version of Robocop. I love the Criterion disc, but the MGM is just more pleasing to the eye, and they fixed the minor sound editing caused by the addition of the extended scenes. I'll never get rid of my Criterion disc, it was the first DVD I ever bought.

canaryfarmer

Yes.

Mondo Kane

Abe.

I'm sure I'll still pick this one up. I even own the UMD... help me

Giggles

I got British R2 SE. That was a conscious pick after checking dvdcompare. And I'm not disappointed.