General Blu-ray News and Discussion - PART 4
12-19-07, 05:43 PM
#201
DVD Talk Legend
I was going to start a new thread, but I guess I'll post my info here and the mods can decide if it's new-thread worthy. 
I've seen Blu-ray's Picture In Picture (via the PS3 update), and - at least as far as RESIDENT EVIL: EXTINCTION goes, it's disappointing.
For starters - it works. No glitches there. No problems (on this title anyway) of freezing or skipping or anything like that.
Here's the real issue: the picture window is incredibly small. I'd say at least half the size you normally see on HD DVD. It's so small that when text identifying the speaker comes up on the screen, it's put to the left of the window, otherwise the viewer wouldn't be able to make it out.
For as small as the window is, you'd think the video would be sharp...but it looked (again, I have only this title to base it on) like the video in the window was playing back at standard resolution, while the movie was in hi-def. I'm not sure if that's even possible, but that's the way it looked.
The window for RESIDENT EVIL: EXTINCTION appeared on the far right of the screen, a little bit above where the bottom black bar (the movie is 2.35:1) begins. There's another window that pops up occassionally in the top right of the screen (again, just below where the top black bar begins) that is used primarily to show artist sketches and storyboards of the scene you're viewing. The two windows never pop-up at the same time.
For the most part on this release, there are no long gaps between windows, but it's not a continuous track.
So the bottom line here is yes, Picture In Picture works fine on Blu-ray, but it's nowhere near (yet) the kind of quality we've been getting on HD DVD.
One caveat - with only this title to look at, it's hard to say yet if the smaller (compared to HD DVD) window and poorer video quality inside it is par for the course for Picture In Picture on Blu-ray or just Sony not doing a very good job with this release. I'm, of course, anxious to see other studios releases and see if they look the same or different.
Also looking forward to getting other users reactions when they get a chance to see this and see if they agree or disagree with my reaction.
I'd say if HD DVD Picture In Picture scores an A, Blu-ray's is a B-minus or C-plus right now.
I've seen Blu-ray's Picture In Picture (via the PS3 update), and - at least as far as RESIDENT EVIL: EXTINCTION goes, it's disappointing.
For starters - it works. No glitches there. No problems (on this title anyway) of freezing or skipping or anything like that.
Here's the real issue: the picture window is incredibly small. I'd say at least half the size you normally see on HD DVD. It's so small that when text identifying the speaker comes up on the screen, it's put to the left of the window, otherwise the viewer wouldn't be able to make it out.
For as small as the window is, you'd think the video would be sharp...but it looked (again, I have only this title to base it on) like the video in the window was playing back at standard resolution, while the movie was in hi-def. I'm not sure if that's even possible, but that's the way it looked.
The window for RESIDENT EVIL: EXTINCTION appeared on the far right of the screen, a little bit above where the bottom black bar (the movie is 2.35:1) begins. There's another window that pops up occassionally in the top right of the screen (again, just below where the top black bar begins) that is used primarily to show artist sketches and storyboards of the scene you're viewing. The two windows never pop-up at the same time.
For the most part on this release, there are no long gaps between windows, but it's not a continuous track.
So the bottom line here is yes, Picture In Picture works fine on Blu-ray, but it's nowhere near (yet) the kind of quality we've been getting on HD DVD.
One caveat - with only this title to look at, it's hard to say yet if the smaller (compared to HD DVD) window and poorer video quality inside it is par for the course for Picture In Picture on Blu-ray or just Sony not doing a very good job with this release. I'm, of course, anxious to see other studios releases and see if they look the same or different.
Also looking forward to getting other users reactions when they get a chance to see this and see if they agree or disagree with my reaction.
I'd say if HD DVD Picture In Picture scores an A, Blu-ray's is a B-minus or C-plus right now.
12-19-07, 05:59 PM
#203
DVD Talk Legend
Originally Posted by Shannon Nutt
Here's the real issue: the picture window is incredibly small. I'd say at least half the size you normally see on HD DVD. It's so small that when text identifying the speaker comes up on the screen, it's put to the left of the window, otherwise the viewer wouldn't be able to make it out.
For as small as the window is, you'd think the video would be sharp...but it looked (again, I have only this title to base it on) like the video in the window was playing back at standard resolution, while the movie was in hi-def. I'm not sure if that's even possible, but that's the way it looked.
For as small as the window is, you'd think the video would be sharp...but it looked (again, I have only this title to base it on) like the video in the window was playing back at standard resolution, while the movie was in hi-def. I'm not sure if that's even possible, but that's the way it looked.
Or, are you saying that the window actually looks like a section of an SD screen?
12-19-07, 06:00 PM
#204
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Originally Posted by dsa_shea
Well, if it isn't worth spending 60 some odd bucks for an entire season of a great show, possibly the best looking release on Blu-Ray, then I don't see the value of spending 20-30 on an individual movie release. If you plan on getting this season on dvd then you're better off to pony up the extra 15-20 to get it in Blu-Ray. I'm not trying to be an ass here. I'm just trying to give you my honest opinion. Also, have you seen or heard one negative response or review of this season on Blu-Ray other than somebody complaining because they don't want to spend any money on it? Check it out because you won't be disappointed.
12-19-07, 06:38 PM
#205
DVD Talk Legend
Originally Posted by Drexl
Maybe I'm misinterpreting what you said, but why wouldn't the PiP video be encoded in standard definition? If it's only going to take up a corner of the screen, why would it be encoded in HD when it's going to be scaled down for display over the movie? It would just waste space and bandwidth. I realize you can swap it to full screen, but that wouldn't make it worth it when it's usually going to be viewed on top of the movie.
Or, are you saying that the window actually looks like a section of an SD screen?
Or, are you saying that the window actually looks like a section of an SD screen?
I think (hope!) Suprmallet is correct - this is more likely a Sony design problem than a PIP capability problem. I'm waiting to see what someone like Disney or FOX does with theirs.
I have a 55" screen, so anyone with a smaller HDTV is going to have a gripe here...I think if you have 60" or larger, you probalby won't have to squint at the screen.
12-19-07, 07:13 PM
#206
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Originally Posted by Mr. Cinema
Paramount did do separate encodes on their titles and I don't recall reading anything about noticeable differences between the BD and HD DVD of the same title.
They also only used 25 gig single layer discs for some Blu-ray titles that did share the same codec...
Last edited by WMAangel; 12-19-07 at 07:19 PM.
12-19-07, 07:20 PM
#207
DVD Talk Legend
Originally Posted by Rusty James
Did you even read what he wrote? His hesitation has nothing to do with Blu-ray vs. SD. He just doesn't know if he's really interested in sitting through a season of TV that he's already seen, especially when there are other titles (like Blade Runner) angling for his attention.
12-19-07, 08:53 PM
#208
Political Exile
I've never seen Lost before, so I'm going to wait until Season 1 gets released to buy it.
12-19-07, 09:13 PM
#209
Originally Posted by PerryD
I've never seen Lost before, so I'm going to wait until Season 1 gets released to buy it.
12-19-07, 09:54 PM
#210
Banned by request
This is the same with Alias. I avoided that show until the seasons came out just because I knew I was going to get lost in the details if I missed an episode. I'm doing with same with Lost.
12-19-07, 10:31 PM
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Dave Vaughn has clued us in that this week will end 61:39 blue. HD DVD did better on the ratio for Harry Potter, 1.2:1 on #5 and 1.3:1 on the box set, but still a blue win. It doesn't look like the red side will win any weeks this year.
12-19-07, 10:41 PM
#212
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Originally Posted by dsa_shea
I know what he said and I know he is a fan of the show. My point was for him to understand the quality of the Blu-Ray set of LOST so that when he considers picking up season 3 he would be wise to invest in the HD version. Also, I'm quite sure he has probably seen Blade Runner before.
12-19-07, 11:01 PM
#213
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Originally Posted by pricdews
Dave Vaughn has clued us in that this week will end 61:39 blue. HD DVD did better on the ratio for Harry Potter, 1.2:1 on #5 and 1.3:1 on the box set, but still a blue win. It doesn't look like the red side will win any weeks this year.
12-19-07, 11:05 PM
#214
DVD Talk Legend
Originally Posted by jiggawhat
Truthfully, I've never seen Blade Runner before. So I can't wait to watch this weekend.
12-19-07, 11:10 PM
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Originally Posted by tonymontana313
What? This was supposed to be the week hd-dvd wins this year. I figured with Bourne and the BOGO, hd-dvd would have had it's first week so I am truly puzzled as to what happened. It will be interesting to see this weeks sales breakdown.
Unless a whole lot of gifted A2's are opened on Christmas, I don't see how HD DVD stands a chance to win a week for the next few months?
12-19-07, 11:13 PM
#216
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Lets start out with the numbers...
Since Blu-ray won I am going to post my thoughts here...
Blu-ray won the week. No surprise here.
Bourne apparently did very well. I imagine this will be Universals best selling Day and Date release to date. Going by last weeks POTC3 numbers, and the usually decline the week after, I think I would be safe to say Bourne sold 70-80k copies. POTC3 did 45-60k. Great numbers for Bourne, and VERY strong numbers for POTC3 which was widely panned as a bad movie.
Now Harry Potter...This is a big win for HD DVD.
With HD DVD having 800k stand alones sold and Blu-ray having somewhere around 3 Million possible players (according to the BDA/Sony), this means a format with 3-4 times the amount of players barley edged out HD DVD with considerably less. This is great news and only makes what I heard that Warner would go HD DVD only make more sense. Considering Harry Potter is a movie that not only appeals to gamers, its also a kids movie which should appeal to the Disney fans of Blu-ray...apparently it didn't. Hell, I'm actually pretty shocked as I had said previously that I thought Blu-ray would outsell HD DVD 2:1 easily, which obviously didn't happen. Looks to me that HD DVD is gaining momentum, even if they continue to lose each and every week. Not surprising when Blu-ray has 3-4 times the amount of players sold and constant BOGOs to further skew the numbers. Keep in mind HP4 has been on HD DVD for close to a year now so it could account for lower HP Boxset sales and lower HP4 sales (not by much, but I imagine it would make a small difference). I imagine once some of these $99 A2s are unwrapped after Christmas Harry Potter will sell some more copies.
A big upset for some will be HSM2 didn't make the Top 10. Many thought this would be the wild card, but it looks like it didn't move to many units. Same can be said about Lost Season 3, which is a shame since it should be an example for both formats on how to handle a TV Show on HDM.
Overall a great week in HDM since the numbers are VERY strong for both formats and show a continued interests in HDM in general. That is GREAT news for people like me who are format neutral.
Again, these are my opinions. I'm sure not everyone will agree with me, and thats fine, but overall this is great news for HDM.
OK…Here is my prediction for this week (Sorry for the delay, but I couldn’t find my prediction hat.
Bourne Ultimatum wins the week handily selling 3 discs for every 2 discs of second place POTC 3, which will show very strong sales in week 2 and pass Casino Royale in total sales.
On the Harry Potter front, sales will be a bit disappointing for such a big blockbuster. For every one HD DVD, the BD will sell 1.2 copies. HD DVD fans will see this as a “win”, but the fact remains, it will still sell more on BD in the first week.
The box sets in each of the formats will have similar results, but the BD’s will sell slightly better by a 1.3 margin. This will most likely be due to some people buying HP 4 from Europe, but who knows. Overall though, box set sales will be about 20% of the single unit sales.
Planet Earth will continue to show very strong sales on both HD DVD and BD, but for the week the HD DVD will sell almost 1.8 copies for every one 1 on BD as it surpasses the six figure mark in sales since it was first released. The BD should surpass this mark in 3-4 weeks if the trends continue.
So, for the week, 6 of the top 20 titles will be red, but Blu dominates again with 14 titles and handily wins the week 61% to 39% on what will be a record volume of sales for both formats.
All that being said though, this is just a prediction on my part
Also, this will be the last week that I post information regarding sales. Some like it, some don't. Some say I'll withhold numbers if they look good for Blu-ray, or post early if they look good for HD DVD. It's a no win situation so I'll just keep the predictions to myself. Enjoy!
Bourne Ultimatum wins the week handily selling 3 discs for every 2 discs of second place POTC 3, which will show very strong sales in week 2 and pass Casino Royale in total sales.
On the Harry Potter front, sales will be a bit disappointing for such a big blockbuster. For every one HD DVD, the BD will sell 1.2 copies. HD DVD fans will see this as a “win”, but the fact remains, it will still sell more on BD in the first week.
The box sets in each of the formats will have similar results, but the BD’s will sell slightly better by a 1.3 margin. This will most likely be due to some people buying HP 4 from Europe, but who knows. Overall though, box set sales will be about 20% of the single unit sales.
Planet Earth will continue to show very strong sales on both HD DVD and BD, but for the week the HD DVD will sell almost 1.8 copies for every one 1 on BD as it surpasses the six figure mark in sales since it was first released. The BD should surpass this mark in 3-4 weeks if the trends continue.
So, for the week, 6 of the top 20 titles will be red, but Blu dominates again with 14 titles and handily wins the week 61% to 39% on what will be a record volume of sales for both formats.
All that being said though, this is just a prediction on my part
Also, this will be the last week that I post information regarding sales. Some like it, some don't. Some say I'll withhold numbers if they look good for Blu-ray, or post early if they look good for HD DVD. It's a no win situation so I'll just keep the predictions to myself. Enjoy!
Blu-ray won the week. No surprise here.
Bourne apparently did very well. I imagine this will be Universals best selling Day and Date release to date. Going by last weeks POTC3 numbers, and the usually decline the week after, I think I would be safe to say Bourne sold 70-80k copies. POTC3 did 45-60k. Great numbers for Bourne, and VERY strong numbers for POTC3 which was widely panned as a bad movie.
Now Harry Potter...This is a big win for HD DVD.
With HD DVD having 800k stand alones sold and Blu-ray having somewhere around 3 Million possible players (according to the BDA/Sony), this means a format with 3-4 times the amount of players barley edged out HD DVD with considerably less. This is great news and only makes what I heard that Warner would go HD DVD only make more sense. Considering Harry Potter is a movie that not only appeals to gamers, its also a kids movie which should appeal to the Disney fans of Blu-ray...apparently it didn't. Hell, I'm actually pretty shocked as I had said previously that I thought Blu-ray would outsell HD DVD 2:1 easily, which obviously didn't happen. Looks to me that HD DVD is gaining momentum, even if they continue to lose each and every week. Not surprising when Blu-ray has 3-4 times the amount of players sold and constant BOGOs to further skew the numbers. Keep in mind HP4 has been on HD DVD for close to a year now so it could account for lower HP Boxset sales and lower HP4 sales (not by much, but I imagine it would make a small difference). I imagine once some of these $99 A2s are unwrapped after Christmas Harry Potter will sell some more copies.
A big upset for some will be HSM2 didn't make the Top 10. Many thought this would be the wild card, but it looks like it didn't move to many units. Same can be said about Lost Season 3, which is a shame since it should be an example for both formats on how to handle a TV Show on HDM.
Overall a great week in HDM since the numbers are VERY strong for both formats and show a continued interests in HDM in general. That is GREAT news for people like me who are format neutral.
Again, these are my opinions. I'm sure not everyone will agree with me, and thats fine, but overall this is great news for HDM.
12-19-07, 11:21 PM
#217
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Originally Posted by GizmoDVD
Now Harry Potter...This is a big win for HD DVD.
1.2 > 1
1.3 > 1
Close only counts in horeshoes and hand grenades?
Not to mention Warner f'ing up the box set for blu (I'm not buying it until I know 5/5 in the case are blue - and of course it's much cheaper!). Spin all you want, the smaller number loses. Try saying "this isn't a huge loss for HD DVD" - you'll sound more credible.
12-19-07, 11:24 PM
#218
DVD Talk Hero
imo, winning means nothing. If they can show adequate interest in the format they will continue to support it. 200k sold is still 200k more sold than 0. Made especially easy considering they use identical encodes.
12-19-07, 11:26 PM
#219
DVD Talk Legend
Originally Posted by tonymontana313
What? This was supposed to be the week hd-dvd wins this year. I figured with Bourne and the BOGO, hd-dvd would have had it's first week so I am truly puzzled as to what happened. It will be interesting to see this weeks sales breakdown.
As far as the last two weeks of the year, while I think Blu will easily win this week based on the Simpsons and Blu sales of Blade Runner, I think there's a chance HD DVD could snag the last week with Eastern Promises, The Kingdom, The Heartbreak Kid (I know it sucked), two new Uni Catalog titles and Pan's Labyrinth. All Blu has is Pan's Labyrinth and some weird title called Azur & Asmar.
The big variable there will be all the gift card money spending. Also, do returns get counted against the totals?
12-19-07, 11:29 PM
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Originally Posted by RichC2
imo, winning means nothing. If they can show adequate interest in the format they will continue to support it. 200k sold is still 200k more sold than 0. Made especially easy considering they use identical encodes.
12-19-07, 11:31 PM
#221
DVD Talk Hero
It'd be stupid for them to go exclusive, in either direction, is all I'm saying.
12-19-07, 11:34 PM
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Originally Posted by bunkaroo
I have to say I'm fairly impressed by the HD DVD HP numbers. Not sure if they mean Blu sold less than it usually does or HD DVD sold more.
As far as the last two weeks of the year, while I think Blu will easily win this week based on the Simpsons and Blu sales of Blade Runner, I think there's a chance HD DVD could snag the last week with Eastern Promises, The Kingdom, The Heartbreak Kid (I know it sucked), two new Uni Catalog titles and Pan's Labyrinth. All Blu has is Pan's Labyrinth and some weird title called Azur & Asmar.
The big variable there will be all the gift card money spending. Also, do returns get counted against the totals?
As far as the last two weeks of the year, while I think Blu will easily win this week based on the Simpsons and Blu sales of Blade Runner, I think there's a chance HD DVD could snag the last week with Eastern Promises, The Kingdom, The Heartbreak Kid (I know it sucked), two new Uni Catalog titles and Pan's Labyrinth. All Blu has is Pan's Labyrinth and some weird title called Azur & Asmar.
The big variable there will be all the gift card money spending. Also, do returns get counted against the totals?
I think the last week will be ruled by previously released titles. What movies that earned under $50m in the box office have had decent rankings as new releases? This week the new releases about canceled out and Blu-ray sold >50% more than HD DVD.
12-19-07, 11:35 PM
#223
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Warner could get a payoff. And they could want the market share compared to DVD to grow to more than 3-5%. Are you saying the other studios are stupid for not going neutral? Cause the 5 other big studios must be stupid then?
12-19-07, 11:35 PM
#224
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Originally Posted by pricdews
1.2 > 1
1.3 > 1
Close only counts in horeshoes and hand grenades?
Not to mention Warner f'ing up the box set for blu (I'm not buying it until I know 5/5 in the case are blue - and of course it's much cheaper!). Spin all you want, the smaller number loses. Try saying "this isn't a huge loss for HD DVD" - you'll sound more credible.
1.3 > 1
Close only counts in horeshoes and hand grenades?
Not to mention Warner f'ing up the box set for blu (I'm not buying it until I know 5/5 in the case are blue - and of course it's much cheaper!). Spin all you want, the smaller number loses. Try saying "this isn't a huge loss for HD DVD" - you'll sound more credible.
But when you add to the fact Blu-ray has 3-4 times more players, that wouldn't be considered very good sales for Blu. They should be outselling 3:1 at least. They did not.
As for small numbers, 200k Blu-ray players vs, 800k for HD DVD. Thats a loss, right? Warner said they want to see SA sales, right?
Regardless, I expect no announcement at CES from Warner going to either side. They will milk this as long as possible.
12-19-07, 11:38 PM
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Originally Posted by bunkaroo
I have to say I'm fairly impressed by the HD DVD HP numbers. Not sure if they mean Blu sold less than it usually does or HD DVD sold more.
As far as the last two weeks of the year, while I think Blu will easily win this week based on the Simpsons and Blu sales of Blade Runner, I think there's a chance HD DVD could snag the last week with Eastern Promises, The Kingdom, The Heartbreak Kid (I know it sucked), two new Uni Catalog titles and Pan's Labyrinth. All Blu has is Pan's Labyrinth and some weird title called Azur & Asmar.
The big variable there will be all the gift card money spending. Also, do returns get counted against the totals?
As far as the last two weeks of the year, while I think Blu will easily win this week based on the Simpsons and Blu sales of Blade Runner, I think there's a chance HD DVD could snag the last week with Eastern Promises, The Kingdom, The Heartbreak Kid (I know it sucked), two new Uni Catalog titles and Pan's Labyrinth. All Blu has is Pan's Labyrinth and some weird title called Azur & Asmar.
The big variable there will be all the gift card money spending. Also, do returns get counted against the totals?
