brayzie

You're posts made me realize I hate Return of the Jedi.

But seriously, a lot of what you said is true. After reading what ROTJ would have been and what you pointed out, it could have really been great.

Vader saying "it's too late for me son," and Luke sounding so simple and childish, "there's still good in you father," was a step backwards from Empire Strikes Back. The Emperor was a big cartoon too. "Yes, kill him so you can take his place." Why would he say that for? Obviously Luke is going to hear that and want to do the opposite.

Endor being populated by Wookies or misunderstood serpent men would have been cool. Vader sounding more like his ESB self would have been better. And Han being rescued only to die in battle, and Luke walking into the distance to wander the galaxy and look for his twin sister (who is NOT Leia) would have been an interesting ending that made you think more. The ending of ROTJ was a little too neatly wrapped.

I can see why Lucas just wanted to wrap things up though. He originally had some big story ideas, but his original goal was to make a homage to the sci-fi serials of yesteryear. He got that and when it turned out to be more successful, he got stressed out in the process, managing everything, going through things, and he felt he had other responsibilities. That's what happens when you spread yourself too thin.

coli

There are many things that come to mind when I watch ROTJ:

-Tired. As someone stated earlier in the thread, it looks like Lucas was going through the motions on this movie, and just wanted to tie everything up in a nice bow, and sort of undo's everything great about ESB. Just think if the 'other' was not Leia, and we could meet the 'other' in this movie who is as powerful as Luke. Leia could have still been a general married to Han in TFA, and they could have hired some actress in her late 50's who was still in good shape to be a jedi like Luke as his sister.

-Pacing: The movie has some serious pacing and editing issues compared to ANH & ESB. ROTJ comes comes to a complete halt at certain parts of the movie, as you could probably edit out about 15 minutes when they first meet the Ewoks.

-Throne Room: The Throne Room scenes alone are the reason why its better then any PT movie. Sure ROTJ has its flaws, but it got right the main scene in the movie between Emperor/Luke/Vader, and the payoff is more then enough to compensate for the other parts that don't work.

-Special Edition: Good god the Special Edition changes made this an even worse movie. The Jedi Rocks addition should have been a red herring to all of us in 1997 that Lucas & McCallum were out of touch in what's cool in the SW universe. Vader's 'no' addition is so uneccessary and again shows that Lucas doesn't understand that you don't have to spell out everything to the viewer. And the ultimate change that I still say is worse then Greedo shooting first is the addition of Hayden as a Force Ghost, and a big F-U to all of the fans that hate the PT. It makes no sense because Lucas's rationale is that Anakin died in ROTS, but misses the whole point of ROTJ where there is still good in him and that saves Luke at the end.

brayzie

I remember first hearing about Leia being the solution to Yoda's comment about there being "another," and thinking how Leia was probably the only practical solution without devaluing Luke's significance. But yeah, why couldn't it be a sister on the other side of the galaxy or something, and at the end when Leia asks Luke where he's going (Han's out of the way so there still could be something between them) he tells her, "to find my sister," before going his own way.
I really wish Lucas hadn't ruined the initial love triangle. It wouldn't be cool to young audiences that the hero doesn't get the girl, but it works in a more realistic way.

Back to the topic though, I really like that there using practical effects, as one of things I loved about the original Star Wars was that the world looked tangible and some place that could be visited, unlike the prequels.

I think they're avoiding the use of "Episode" in the title to further disassociate this new series with Lucas's prequels. The original films didn't have "episode..." on the poster or adverts.

Solid Snake

I doubt that. That doesn't seem like something that they'd do. Shit. Leia is the most useless of the 3 and she's still there. I doubt Luke is all force ghost now too.

Harrison Ford loves getting a big ass paycheck when the stipulations for it ring his way.

Even the palace has issues though. Got some crap acting from the lead actors too. RotJ will never be a steadily good movie.

Yeah. it's just all over the goddamn place. Made worse w/ each special edition.

Solid Snake

Rob V

So if Leia is "the other" the I expect her to use some serious Force powers in TFA... otherwise, wtf?
And that said, I suspect she won't use a single Force power in TFA... because that would probably come off very hokey.

bunkaroo

I was just watching ROTJ with my fiancee yesterday (she wasn't really familiar with the films) and we were talking about this.

I'm guessing though if Luke has been gone for all the time between ROTJ and TFA, no one would have been there to help her train anyway.

It would nice to see her pull something off in a pinch though.

stvn1974

Just as long as Leia doesn't start doing back flips and bouncing off walls.

redcon1

She's crying because E.T. is going home.

That's what that cap reminds me of.

raven56706

Trailers that have secured a spot before Star Wars:

Deadpool
X-men: apocalypse
Captain America: Civil war
Batman V. Superman
TMNT2
Independence Day 2
Star Trek: Beyond
Suicide Squad

E Unit

Jesus, that's too many. 8 trailers at 2 minutes each (more or less), 16 minutes? Then the commercials and whatnot. Shit.

Solid Snake

I have to tolerate a TMNT2 and ID2 trailer too. Man. Those films shouldn't have sequels at all.

Timber

2 Fox Marvel and 2 DC. That's 1 too many of each and probably should just be one comic movie which would logically be Captain America based off of who owns both companies. I do like the idea on Star Trek and ID2 being in front of this.

raven56706

they secured rights but they dont show all of them on each screen. Some show on certain theaters and etc

dex14

Correct.

Obi-Wanma

Yeah, pretty much the only one you will for sure see at every theater is Civil War.

dex14

And Star Trek Beyond... most likely.

Josh-da-man

Mabuse

So. Still no MPAA rating?

stvn1974

I think it has been rated PG13.

Obi-Wanma

It has.

Rated PG-13 for sci-fi action violence

Breakfast with Girls

inri222

And graphic droid nudity.

MBoyd

Funny the original ID4 had a special edition trailer in front of it.

Shazam