devilshalo

All of his vehicles in the films were most likely pre-equipped since they were military prototypes.

To me, his hand to hand thought process is much like Leon's. It is the ultimate goal to get as close to your enemy without their knowledge using stealth and surprise. Obviously it is different in that Leon will kill, whereas Batman will not.

This is why I thought it would be better for John Blake to become Azreal. He did use his pistol to kill when necessary.

RocShemp

Not originally. Hell, there are even a few issues where he's seen packing heat. However, sometime during the 80's (I think that was the timeframe but someone else can correct me) a few writers tried to instill this whole no-guns thing. Heck, I remember at one point during "The Untold Origin of the Batman" miniseries, Batman beat the living shit out of a thug just because the guy dared pull a gun at him. He even yelled "you dare pull a gun on me?!" as he beat the living shit out of the guy.

robin2099

He stopped carrying and using guns waaaaaaaaaay back towards his initial debut. If memory serves me correctly the gun use stopped when a couple issues before the debut of Robin.

The Valeyard

If it makes anyone feel better, Finger's one heir does get a regular check from DC.




Oh I know that. DC's whole Silver Age is a reboot so they've been doing it for decades. They wanted to do this New 52 stunt back after Infinite Crisis and then after Final Crisis but Paul Levitz wouldn't let them. Once Warner got involved and Levitz "left," the flood gates opened. The New 52 was a Hail Mary pass to show the "suits" that DC could compete with Marvel.

Jim Lee's Wildstorm Universe also reboot itself a couple of times under DC before joining the New 52.

And yes, Marvel still uses a sliding scale.


EDIT: Thanks for that link. Good reading!

Dr. DVD

Actually, Robin was just beaten but not tied to the bomb. His biological mother was tied and he got her free, problem is Joker locked the door and they couldn't get out before the bomb detonated. Thought that might have been Batman's perception of what happened.

I was kind of unimpressed overall with Man of Steel, maybe a few extra viewings will change my mind once it hits BR. TDKR actually got better with more viewings.

taffer

The Untold Legend of Batman miniseries was actually just a retelling of older stories. The whole thing with Batman beating the shit out a guy who dared pull a gun on him originally happened in a Denny O'Neil story from the 70s. That story was titled There Is No Hope In Crime Alley from Detective Comics #457, and it was also was the first appearance of Leslie Thompkins.

Scan from the miniseries:



Scan from the Denny O'Neil story:



Regarding the no-gun rule, it was originally established during Denny O'Neil's Batman run during the 70s. (Hence the beating the shit out of the guy above).

Post-COIE, I believe it was re-established after Batman: Year Two. Year Two had Bruce save Joe Chill's gun because Bruce planned to use it to murder Chill (much like what happened in Nolan's Batman Begins). Bruce realized he couldn't actually go through with it, and so began the no-guns rule.

RocShemp

Thanks, taffer. It'd been so long that my memory of it all was real fuzzy.

Dr. DVD

I had a smaller TPB of Untold Legend of Batman in b&w in seventh grade. Pretty thorough coverage of the story, only thing I didn't care for was it made Alfred Pennyworth a random butler who happened upon Bruce and Dick as opposed to someone who had been with the Waynes for a several generations.

taffer

They printed it in B&W? I know at one point in time they actually gave the miniseries away as the prize in a cereal box. (That's actually where I got it from.) There was also a cassette tape audio-book version which I got that from a flea market long ago.

Mike86

Shit those look like some good issues. I always like O'Neil's stuff but don't think I've read them. Are they collected in a trade somewhere or is the name of the trade The Untold Legend of Batman?

taffer

I am unsure if The Untold Legend was ever collected. It probably was. The single issues shouldn't be hard to find though, since as I said DC gave them away in cereal boxes. There are probably tons of copies.

The O'Neil issue was collected in the Greatest Batman Stories Ever told trade. That's where I actually read it. That would be the original trade from the late 1980s. DC published another Greatest Stories trade later on that I believe collects different issues, although I can't confirm that since I never read that trade.

Edit to add:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...ries_Ever_Told

That shows the various Greatest Stories trades. It looks like there are indeed various volumes reprinting different issues. The only two I have read are the Batman and Joker trades from 1988. The O'Neil story is Detective Comics #457, and it looks like it is only collected in that original volume.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...ecade_editions

The decade trades look like they reprint that issue too in the 70s trade.

RocShemp

The Untold Legend of the Batman was collected as a small paperback. A friend of mine had that. I had it as three issues with three audio cassettes. The theme song is cheesy as hell but I really liked it as a kid.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/jIjnvDFjgQY" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Josh-da-man

As has been mentioned, Batman did sometimes use a gun in his early Golden Age appearances.

The Golden Age Superman would also kill people, too. Usually by dropping them from a great height.

RocShemp

Whattaya know? Youtube has all three tapes uploaded. This brings back memories.

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/K92KciDNWoY" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/gCsOzSR6hn8" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/49rP-NVtNaU" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

taffer

Youtube copyright infringement to the rescue!!

Wow. Are those the actual cassette tape recordings or just some youtube nerd reading it? I don't recall the tapes having such cheesy voice acting, but then again I haven't listened to them in 20 years.

RocShemp

Those are the original tape recordings. Complete with Englishman Batman.

taffer

I guess I just don't remember the tapes that well. The comics still do hold up fairly well today (I re-read them maybe a year or so ago and still liked them) but those tapes don't hold up well at all. They are bordering on Adam West camp. Can you imagine if DC used that same Batman voice actor in B:TAS instead of Kevin Conroy? That would have been as scary as Bat-nipples.

RocShemp

I practically wore out those tapes so I remember those voices quite well.

It's funny that you mentioned Adam West camp because the VA for Robin in the tapes makes me think of Burt Ward.

bluetoast

This talk of tapes makes me want to seek out the Ninja Turtles cassette "Return of the Shredder." The first story is on Youtube but not that one.

brayzie

I think I had those books but I can't be sure if they came with an audio tape. The comics themselves were smaller than normal sized comics.

I was shocked to learn, and couldn't accept that Bruce Wayne first started fighting crime as a kid, and as the original Robin. It sounded fake at the time. I'm glad DC never stuck with it. The comics were still fun though, and that theme song is pretty good for what it was.

taffer

Bruce Wayne as the original Robin, and also Thomas Wayne as the original Batman, are both taken from 1950s/60s Silver Age stories. There's actually nothing in The Untold Legend of Batman that was original. It was just a modern retelling of old classics.

RocShemp

The tapes came with regular sized comics.

I must admit, I enjoyed playing that theme song over and over again.

brayzie

I knew that the "First Batman" was from the silver age but all this time I blamed Marv Wolfman for that "When Batman was Robin" nonesense.

PhantomStranger

That was the de facto mainstream interpretation of Batman for the past few decades. Denny O'Neil really pushed it in his version of the character. O'Neil was a well-known liberal that liked to push his politics through his stories, including gun control and other things.

Mr. Cinema

Please post more comic book covers!!!! Please!!!!!!!!!!